Occupy Movement. 🔫🔫©
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ßelial wrote:
Quit being so stupid. You know better than that.No brown. Taxes on the rich have been going down. Because of bush it's down to 35%. While the taxes on lost middle class is only 10%. How can a class that has 1000x higher income only be paying 5% more of that? I'd say that's more than out of balance
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Let me be clear.
A flat tax is: everyone pays $5000.
A progressive tax is: everyone pays 10%
An oppressive tax is one where you are penalized for earning "too much".
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Brown🎵Note🇺🇸🐔🔫 wrote:
Well one may claim this protester only hurt himself. Still as with most news stories we get one side of the story, namely the sisters point of view. Not to say people were not hurt for sure. That is the thing we all seem to be connected. What about socialism? Instead of democracy? Some countries have extremely high taxes, around 33%, but also offer social systems. Thoughts? 🔫🔫©http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEs5V0c6e1A&feature=youtube_gdata_player
This guy?
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Socialism is an economic system. Democracy is a political leadership system. They are not incompatible. The original Soviets were for extreme local democracy. They were subverted by Lenin and the Bolsheviks in the 3rd revolution from the czarist parliamentary government.
As for me, I believe in minimal federal government as necessary, and adequately independent state and local governments. Something that has eroded in the last century in the United States.
I believe in personal property rights. The right to own, earn, and use my wealth as I see fit.
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Problem is most of these protests into riots, not only in the US but the occupy movement around the world, that's why I don't support it.
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YOU wrote:
turn into riotsProblem is most of these protests into riots, not only in the US but the occupy movement around the world, that's why I don't support it.
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Linking arms is a sign of solidarity. It's been used since the civil rights movement. It's passive resistance to thwart the divide and conquer goals of the police.
They are asking to be seen and heard, not beaten. Big difference.
That's one of the big problems with this countries idea of freedom. It's only cool of it suites certain individuals. If I believe in it then it's okay but by God if I don't then no way any one else should enjoy that freedom. -
Fat Raymond wrote:
This only happens in countries where they are not allowed to peaceably assemble, unless it's a football game. I've seen riots from those. ;)YOU wrote:
turn into riotsProblem is most of these protests into riots, not only in the US but the occupy movement around the world, that's why I don't support it.
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ßelial wrote:
So are you basically trying to say that if I work hard and make a lot of money that I should be taxed because of how much money I worked for? If you take two people and one works twice as hard as the other so he makes twice the money the other guy did, then he gets taxed because he made a lot of money and ends up with the same amount that the slacker made what sense does that make? Just saying that's what it sounded like you were sayingNo brown. Taxes on the rich have been going down. Because of bush it's down to 35%. While the taxes on lost middle class is only 10%. How can a class that has 1000x higher income only be paying 5% more of that? I'd say that's more than out of balance
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It's not about the average Joe who works harder than his neighbor on a double shift to make ends meet. It's about the obscence bonuses of the few (the 10%) who manipulate the system to their own benefit and screw the working stiff out of his hard earned pension, not to mention all the millions who are unemployed because of this manipulation. So if the masses are not happy with the status quo, should the masses just roll over and accept it?
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BakedBananas wrote:
No, you're right. They should stop working, bite the hand that feeds them, and crap in a tent. That'll fix it.It's not about the average Joe who works harder than his neighbor on a double shift to make ends meet. It's about the obscence bonuses of the few (the 10%) who manipulate the system to their own benefit and screw the working stiff out of his hard earned pension, not to mention all the millions who are unemployed because of this manipulation. So if the masses are not happy with the status quo, should the masses just roll over and accept it?
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Brown🎵Note🇺🇸🐔🔫 wrote:
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍whitey bulger wrote:
Right. He was just walking down the street, window shopping, and BAM! Hit with a can of tear gas. I'M OUTRAGED!!!Oakland is where the protesting Iraq vet was critically injured by a cop a few weeks ago. He was put in the hospital for doing nothing more than being on the street.
Or maybe he should have not been involved in a confrontation with riot police in the first place.
Peaceful protesters are rarely assaulted by police. Like... Almost never.
When asked to move by cops, do it. Simple. Do not instead march toward them at night shouting obscenities. Just a tip.
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I work blocks away from Occupy Oakland. In a city with perpetually one of the highest homicide rates in the country, one of the highest foreclosure rates, a severe lack of jobs, and at a time when Oakland's tearing down elementary schools, I think there are FAR more important issues for the city to focus on. I walked through Ogawa Plaza, and I never felt unsafe there. It may be a nuisance, but not more so than the 100+ murders so far (in a city with only 400K people). Provide jobs, curtail the violence, and stop dismantling our kids' education before worrying about Occupy.
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What makes you think the top one percent work any harder than the average guy. And who said they should make the same? Taxes on the top class started at 90% and they did just fine. It's now down to 35%. Something is wrong here. Those that get more benefit to the system should give back more. a simple concept.
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Brown🎵Note🇺🇸🐔🔫 wrote:
It's not a penalty. It's giving back to the system that gave you why you have. By taxing the rich a little more we can tax the poor less. This assuring that a higher percentage of people receive a living wageLet me be clear.
A flat tax is: everyone pays $5000.
A progressive tax is: everyone pays 10%
An oppressive tax is one where you are penalized for earning "too much".
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Our society is regressing to the 19th century philosophy that the rich are somehow better and harder working than everyone else. It isn't true in the slightest.
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ßelial wrote:
What makes you think the top one percent work any harder than the average guy.
The fact that the jackasses flipping burgers at Burger King are cutting jokes and moving slow as shit in Siberia while I rush to get to work for a 12 or 16 hr shift where I don't stop long enough to sit down to eat for 15 minutes. The fact that my boss is running around like a chicken with his head cut off when customers are pissed and screaming at him. And his boss has the same deal, showing up at all hours of the night to put out fires when people are being unreasonable. What is the BK burger flipper doing? Facebooking. -
41Fivin' wrote:
So the people shouldn't be working on ways to try to fix the issues they fiend themselves in? Just sit back and hope the government fixes it?I work blocks away from Occupy Oakland. In a city with perpetually one of the highest homicide rates in the country, one of the highest foreclosure rates, a severe lack of jobs, and at a time when Oakland's tearing down elementary schools, I think there are FAR more important issues for the city to focus on. I walked through Ogawa Plaza, and I never felt unsafe there. It may be a nuisance, but not more so than the 100+ murders so far (in a city with only 400K people). Provide jobs, curtail the violence, and stop dismantling our kids' education before worrying about Occupy.
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It pisses me off with all these ass clowns saying 1% this and that. Last year I made less than $10k. Since march this year I have cleared over $60k (conservative guess based on 25k by June). I know if I keep working like this (2 jobs working between 52-90hrs a week), I can make a very comfortable living. I won't be the top of any class but I will be able to do what I want without too much worry towards finances. I got that by HARD FUCKING WORK!!! NOT SITTING IN A FUCKING PARK! And not by accepting handouts from the rest of society.
And Banana I manipulate my coworkers to get their holiday shifts. Why? BECAUSE I GET PAID MORE! If the masses aren't happy with the status quo, go get an education in a useful field. Not a fucking liberal arts degree. How many nurses do you know that can't find a job? How many cops? How many actors? Difference is we need nurses, doctors, and cops, but we don't need more actors.
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Brown🎵Note🇺🇸🐔🔫 wrote:
Protesting at this point is about the only way to even hope for changes. In truth it won't work. Theres absolutely no way USA will ever be able to come out of this. Our credit rating is permanently trashed. We are trillions in debt and the rich are just concerned with looting everything they can before the country collapsesBakedBananas wrote:
No, you're right. They should stop working, bite the hand that feeds them, and crap in a tent. That'll fix it.So if the masses are not happy with the status quo, should the masses just roll over and accept it?
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ßelial wrote:
Taxes on the top class were 0% prior to 1911, and they were just fine then.What makes you think the top one percent work any harder than the average guy. And who said they should make the same? Taxes on the top class started at 90% and they did just fine. It's now down to 35%. Something is wrong here. Those that get more benefit to the system should give back more. a simple concept.
Don't you get it? 35% of $1,000,000 is $350,000.
10% of $20,000 is $2000.
You don't think the rich pay more than their fair share already? That's 1750 times more than the 20K guy, and he only earns 50 times as much.
If you want private property rights, you can't confiscate everything you consider wealth.
We vote for our tax rates through our representatives.
You think taking $100Bn in taxes from the capitalists will benefit the economy or eliminate 10T in debt? Derp.
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Those things aren't the top 1%. Largely the top 1% dodnt even work. They just steal what they have. And IMO you shouldn't have to work that many hours to get a living wage. No point in working if you don't have time to enjoy what you worked for
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ßelial wrote:
What makes you think they don't work harder than the average guy? Do you know any of them personally? Why should they be penalized? Got any first hand knowledge to backup your claims? And does a higher tax bracket really work out to an equally lower tax bracket for lower income persons? What about the impact on the economy when the "1%" react to higher taxation?What makes you think the top one percent work any harder than the average guy. And who said they should make the same? Taxes on the top class started at 90% and they did just fine. It's now down to 35%. Something is wrong here. Those that get more benefit to the system should give back more. a simple concept.
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Simple solution. Anyone that makes more than $200k needs to pay 75%. Anyone that makes less than that doesn't pay
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ßelial wrote:
Well if I read your comment correctly, you are talking about the criminals? Those that steal what they have would be criminals. I don't think many of them pay taxesThose things aren't the top 1%. Largely the top 1% dodnt even work. They just steal what they have. And IMO you shouldn't have to work that many hours to get a living wage. No point in working if you don't have time to enjoy what you worked for
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ßelial wrote:
They steal and sit back and enjoy their "earnings." (you say). You don't want to have to work so much because you want to sit back, relax, and enjoy your money. Sounds like the same thing to me. (almost) you want to be like them and you're pissed about it.Those things aren't the top 1%. Largely the top 1% dodnt even work. They just steal what they have. And IMO you shouldn't have to work that many hours to get a living wage. No point in working if you don't have time to enjoy what you worked for
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Clyde⌖Barrow wrote:
Nah. I'm talking about your corporations. Then again corporations and criminals are the same thingßelial wrote:
Well if I read your comment correctly, you are talking about the criminals? Those that steal what they have would be criminals. I don't think many of them pay taxesThose things aren't the top 1%. Largely the top 1% dodnt even work. They just steal what they have. And IMO you shouldn't have to work that many hours to get a living wage. No point in working if you don't have time to enjoy what you worked for
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ßelial wrote:
FUCK THAT!!!! I'm in my first year out of school and probably gonna break 80k. In 3 or 4 yrs, I could potentially break that. Not to mention that you are asking those people to carry the rest of the country!Simple solution. Anyone that makes more than $200k needs to pay 75%. Anyone that makes less than that doesn't pay
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Clyde⌖Barrow wrote:
Right now the rest of the country is carrying them. This isn't unheard of. This is near the exact tax amount on the rich from the 50s. Back when the economy is goodßelial wrote:
FUCK THAT!!!! I'm in my first year out of school and probably gonna break 80k. In 3 or 4 yrs, I could potentially break that. Not to mention that you are asking those people to carry the rest of the country!Simple solution. Anyone that makes more than $200k needs to pay 75%. Anyone that makes less than that doesn't pay
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ßelial wrote:
Math/basic human rights fail.Simple solution. Anyone that makes more than $200k needs to pay 75%. Anyone that makes less than that doesn't pay
75% of my income would drop me below the poverty line.
Why did I get my degree? Why do I work here when I could get a shit job with less responsibility for the same money?
And I'm afraid our bills will never get paid if we don't tax 95% of the working people.
You are pure socialist. Go be happy in western China.
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