Corruption, Greed, Politics, etc
Forums › General Discussion › Corruption, Greed, Politics, etc-
Mystery wrote:
Corporations use more state resources. Like roads. The other two I didn't respond about really. And I say no to fascism.Um, no to communism!!
How has the "system" given "rich" people everything? What resources do they use more of? How are you even defining "rich?"
-
Mystery wrote:
Doesn't mean I have to accept it.💀DEATH💀 wrote:
Life isn't fair.__Don_Line__ wrote:
Why not? We weren't given the same oppertubities? Because life chose to bless them and screw me I should accept it? Fuck thatI mean that they move their main bases out of America. Priority is granted to other countries. and this loses American jobs. Bigger hits on the economy.
also, "the rich" and "the poor" are not statuses. You really have to define it. I think B is talking about multi-billionaires, who are very few. it's all about how much you earn. Just because yiru job isn't as nice as the rich guy's doesn't mean you should get more.
-
Mystery wrote:
Yeah don't mix me up with that arguement. Lol💀DEATH💀 wrote:
Life isn't fair.__Don_Line__ wrote:
Why not? We weren't given the same oppertubities? Because life chose to bless them and screw me I should accept it? Fuck thatI mean that they move their main bases out of America. Priority is granted to other countries. and this loses American jobs. Bigger hits on the economy.
also, "the rich" and "the poor" are not statuses. You really have to define it. I think B is talking about multi-billionaires, who are very few. it's all about how much you earn. Just because yiru job isn't as nice as the rich guy's doesn't mean you should get more.
-
💀DEATH💀 wrote:
You don't have to accept it. However, it sounds as though you think the government or someone owes you to make up for the fact that it's not fair.Mystery wrote:
Doesn't mean I have to accept it.💀DEATH💀 wrote:
Life isn't fair.__Don_Line__ wrote:
Why not? We weren't given the same oppertubities? Because life chose to bless them and screw me I should accept it? Fuck thatI mean that they move their main bases out of America.
"Rich" and "poor" are not statuses. You really have to define it. I think B is talking about multi-billionaires, who are very few. it's all about how much you earn. Just because yiru job isn't as nice as the rich guy's doesn't mean you should get more.
-
To be a bit more indepth about what I said about resouces: Rich/ corporations use more of the commons such as court system, highways, sewer, regulatory agencies (we need to use their taxes to regulate corporations because they won't do it themselves), education for educated workers, assets over seas our military has to defend.
This is basically the arguement for progressive taxation.
In the simplist of terms shit we all pay for that they use more of that they should have to pay more for. Like it or not we chose a socialist type system from the beginning. We are all in this together and we have to act like it, rich or poor.
People have this tendency to think we shouldn't have to pay to be a community until they need the community to do something for them like build roads or keep a person off the street that has dementia and no way to fend for themselves. It's about the common good not the good of the rich.
-
That makes sense, but I wouldn't lump a single person into the same category as a corporation. Corportions may use more resources, but that doesn't mean 1 "rich" person does.
-
I think if somebody does well in school, and in college, they deserve to have better income, aka "Rich". If you didn't care much for high school, went to college for a while, and got out, you get an average job. Many billionaires are billionaires because they did excellent in school and college, kissed as many asses as possible, and now own large corporations. I think they should not have to pay more for doing well in life.
-
🍀Joe Zingg🍀 wrote:
And yet Steve Jobbs was a college drop out. College has nothing to do with it.I think if somebody does well in school, and in college, they deserve to have better income, aka "Rich". If you didn't care much for high school, went to college for a while, and got out, you get an average job. Many billionaires are billionaires because they did excellent in school and college, kissed as many asses as possible, and now own large corporations. I think they should not have to pay more for doing well in life.
-
Mystery wrote:
Yeah but generally rich people don't get rich in a vaacum.That makes sense, but I wouldn't lump a single person into the same category as a corporation. Corportions may use more resources, but that doesn't mean 1 "rich" person does.
And Joe you aren't taking anything into account when you say that. Like the facts I listed above you.
-
Λdོdོi wrote:
I'm not saying they do. But you don't tax people & businesses the same way.Mystery wrote:
Yeah but generally rich people don't get rich in a vaacum.That makes sense, but I wouldn't lump a single person into the same category as a corporation. Corportions may use more resources, but that doesn't mean 1 "rich" person does.
And Joe you aren't taking anything into account when you say that. Like the facts I listed above you.
-
In fact lots of people besides "rich" people get all kinds of breaks on their taxes. If you are under a very low amount you don't even have to file (although sometimes you can still get money back). People get breaks for things like kids & being in school, farmers & fishermen get taxed differently, etc.
-
Progressive taxation is designed to take a certain amount disposable income. The rich have more disposable income; there's only so much you can squeeze out of the poor. You have to take into account what they have left after their monthly necessities. It would be like squeezing juice out of a dry lemon.
The system we have cost money and we decided a long time ago that those who were best suited to pay for it would. This isnt some new thing. Politicians have this way of making things seem current and just outragious when its the least outragious its ever been. No rich person has ever been taxed into the poor house even when it was 90%, 70%, 50% and most recently 35%. That's one reason we have tax brackets. The brackets aren't as basic as most think. The first 25k they pay nothing like poor people, goes up a little at say 50k, up a bit more once they get to 250k. You get the idea--not necessarily accurate numbers. So, the amount they pay changes as the amount taken in goes up.
-
Original argument on the other thread was to fix the loopholes on everything. At this point, normal every day people, get too many tax breaks. So I certainly agree every one should be paying their part and not getting it back in April from some loophole or another. A lot would fix itself then. But the bigger problem is still with the rich because they are the bigger tax provider. Like the 20000 or so businesses that have an address in the caymen islands at this one building to avoid any taxation. And of course I think the bush tax breaks need to expire next year when they are suppose to. That would raise the top bracket back to 39%. Notice we had a budget crisis 8 years later. These things don't happen over night either. That would also boost our economy.
-
The easy way to get growth is for the working class to get paid more. More money coming in means we can borrow and consume more than we currently are. To do this the government should impose a max net profit level (based on many several factors so will be different for all company sizes) the surplus is then divided up between the work force. IE a small IT company is allowed to profit £10 million pounds. It makes a net profit of £15 million pounds so must give £5 million extra to it's staff. The only trouble is we might get companies fudging the books to look like they havnt profited as much as they have. This will need monitoring by a new gov body who will impose fines etc and that the surplus goes all the way to the bottom and not taken solely by the top guys in the companies. This would also slow the giant corps taking over the world and encourage more competition.
-
Shaun, that's well put. It'll be a long time before this country realizes how happy and content European socialist are and want to take it on as well. You guys are statistically the happiest people in the world though and have the least income disparity in the world. Our country has been fed this idea that communism and socialism are one in the same so they can keep their thumb on us. Communism is a system of govt and socialism is an economic system just to clarify for those that don't know.
On another note - Excess profits are reinvested when taxes are higher because companies would rather expand and hire employees then pay the govt. When taxes are low, businesses horde money and don't reinvest because they can just keep it. Therefore, low taxes funnel money upward and that is part of the cause of the larger gap between the rich and the poor. Also the static income rate. Notice income doesn't go up but the cost of living does.
-
No, life isn't fair, but does that mean that we have to accept it? The difference between the "haves" and the "have nots" has increased disproportionately in the past decade, to the extent that something like 10% of the population now own approx 90% of the wealth (can't remember the exact figures). We are returning to the times of the turn of the 18th century when the gap between the wealthy and the poor was so great. Yes, there are skivers living off welfare who shouldn't be, but we don't have to throw the baby out with the bathwater and cut benefits to those who really need them, we need to police more thoroughly and prosecute those who cheat the system.
-
http://m.motherjones.com/politics/2011/02/income-inequality-in-america-chart-graph
explains its self
-
💀DEATH💀 wrote:
So was Bill Gates. Either way, both of them studied VERY MUCH. Just because they didn't learn what they learnt in college, doesn't mean they can't be rich either.🍀Joe Zingg🍀 wrote:
And yet Steve Jobbs was a college drop out. College has nothing to do with it.I think if somebody does well in school, and in college, they deserve to have better income, aka "Rich". If you didn't care much for high school, went to college for a while, and got out, you get an average job. Many billionaires are billionaires because they did excellent in school and college, kissed as many asses as possible, and now own large corporations. I think they should not have to pay more for doing well in life.
PS:
Definition of "rich" for this thread:
Someone with lots of money that owns more than Belial does.
-
And if you aren't going to accept that life isn't fair, then beat the odds and try to earn more.
-
__Don_Line__ wrote:
Any suggestion in howAnd if you aren't going to accept that life isn't fair, then beat the odds and try to earn more.
-
My stance/statement on this:
Government should stop giving out bailouts to banks and corporations.
Working hard and learning well gives you a good chance of being "rich"(above definition).
REALLY "rich" persons are the base of economy in post industrial systems. Life isn't fair.
B sure does know how to argue like a politician that hates politicians.
Some people don't like to work or put in effort. This makes you poor.
1 rich guy pays more in taxes than 1000 "middle class".
I support a left wing system. For those not politically learned, that means I believe in the good nature of humans. I'd support a democracy. However, right wing is not without benefits. -
__Don_Line__ wrote:
So young. Working hard and learning well has absolutely no bearing on being rich. It's an oppertunity thing and oppertubities aren't available to allMy stance/statement on this:
Government should stop giving out bailouts to banks and corporations.
Working hard and learning well gives you a good chance of being "rich"(above definition).
REALLY "rich" persons are the base of economy in post industrial systems. Life isn't fair.
B sure does know how to argue like a politician that hates politicians.
Some people don't like to work or put in effort. This makes you poor.
1 rich guy pays more in taxes than 1000 "middle class".
I support a left wing system. For those not politically learned, that means I believe in the good nature of humans. I'd support a democracy. However, right wing is not without benefits. -
Steve Jobs was born into an average family. By all means, he was meant to be an average person. Yet look at what he did. Although someone born into a "rich" family has more resources and advantages, if you work and study enough, you should be able to do well.
Example: Larry Page and Sergey Brin of Google barely hada ny money. They build their first computers by "scavenging" parts from the docks. Now they're both billionaires. And what you said, that working hard and learning well has ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING ON BEING RICH is not true. What you're saying is that if you are lazy but rich, you will succeed in life. DOubtful.
-
krissharm wrote:
Study harder. Do whatever you can to support your learning.__Don_Line__ wrote:
Any suggestion in howAnd if you aren't going to accept that life isn't fair, then beat the odds and try to earn more.
-
__Don_Line__ wrote:
It isn't about that. Thousands upon thousands of smart people will never get anywhere in this world. The difference is sometimes life gives opertunities to some. Don't celebrate people just because they were luckykrissharm wrote:
Study harder. Do whatever you can to support your learning.__Don_Line__ wrote:
Any suggestion in howAnd if you aren't going to accept that life isn't fair, then beat the odds and try to earn more.
-
💀DEATH💀 wrote:
Yes. SOme people are disadvantaged. But if you truly take initiative, there is no doubt you won't be living on the streets, at least. No one is guaranteed a "rich" life.__Don_Line__ wrote:
It isn't about that. Thousands upon thousands of smart people will never get anywhere in this world. The difference is sometimes life gives opertunities to some. Don't celebrate people just because they were luckykrissharm wrote:
Study harder. Do whatever you can to support your learning.__Don_Line__ wrote:
Any suggestion in howAnd if you aren't going to accept that life isn't fair, then beat the odds and try to earn more.
-
It's unfortunate when a thread like this is taken over by emotional arguement. Arguing politics with your emotions is lax and really it's what the general population does. Those un-informed.
-
Λdོdོi wrote:
Am I one of "those un-informed"?It's unfortunate when a thread like this is taken over by emotional arguement. Arguing politics with your emotions is lax and really it's what the general population does. Those un-informed.
-
A couple of you are both right in a way. Working hard and being educated will get you a greater % chance of being rich but it is not guaranteed. But you do have a % chance just by working hard and being uneducated. It is more opportunity and having the right contacts these days because times have changed. There is too much of a monopoly these days. So when you quote oh those guys who made google and this guy and another who made something out of nothing, there is now less nothing around now to make into something if that makes sense. I am sure there is still the odd new crazy idea that may work but the % of this Market is drastically lower than what it was even just a decade ago. And then you probably need a business angel like dragon den to invest and take a % of your business.
-
Mighty Shaun wrote:
+1.A couple of you are both right in a way. Working hard and being educated will get you a greater % chance of being rich but it is not guaranteed. But you do have a % chance just by working hard and being uneducated. It is more opportunity and having the right contacts these days because times have changed. There is too much of a monopoly these days. So when you quote oh those guys who made google and this guy and another who made something out of nothing, there is now less nothing around now to make into something if that makes sense. I am sure there is still the odd new crazy idea that may work but the % of this Market is drastically lower than what it was even just a decade ago. And then you probably need a business angel like dragon den to invest and take a % of your business.
![[][]](https://turfwarsapp.com/img/app/ajax-forbutton.gif)
Purchase Respect Points NEW! · Support · Turf Map · Terms · Privacy
©2021 MeanFreePath LLC