Historical debate
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Did president Harry Truman make the right decision when he dropped the nuclear bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki? ✨✨✨read the facts first(from my history text book)✨✨✨
1. Truman was given an estimated number of American deaths around 1 million if they invaded instead. This number was given to him and its accuracy isn't given by my text book because it is debated.
2. The first bomb kill 80,000 instantly, and more after that from radiation, suffocation from buildings, etc.
3. The second killed 40,000 instantly with more afterward from similar reasons to Hiroshima
4. The Japanese didn't surrender after the first bomb because they thought we didn't have another one
5. The Japanese debated for another 5 days after the second bomb on if they should surrender (they did)
6. The bomb may not have worked. It wasn't a 100% science back then and if it failed,all our nuclear secrets would be handed to them in a metal case. Also scientists were worried that it would light all the oxygen on earth on fire... -
killing us all (yes it is true, scientists also thought humans would explode if they went more than 20 mph in a car 😂)
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All your points seem negative as if you're trying to sway the debate a bit making people believe he was wrong before the debate even begins.
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Kaͣrͩaͩs wrote:
Those are the facts positive or negative,that is what they are I can't just make up facts to balance it outAll your points seem negative as if you're trying to sway the debate a bit making people believe he was wrong before the debate even begins.
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YOU wrote:
There is supposed to be a period after areKaͣrͩaͩs wrote:
Those are the facts positive or negative,that is what they are. I can't just make up facts to balance it outAll your points seem negative as if you're trying to sway the debate a bit making people believe he was wrong before the debate even begins.
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Killing people in general is bad.
But in terms of weapon technology, it was a huge step. -
⚡🏀ʟєցi†ßɑʟʟєʀ🏀⚡ wrote:
And after out.YOU wrote:
There is supposed to be a period after areKaͣrͩaͩs wrote:
Those are the facts positive or negative,that is what they are. I can't just make up facts to balance it out.All your points seem negative as if you're trying to sway the debate a bit making people believe he was wrong before the debate even begins.
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For the situation, it appears it was right to do what he did. I don't have an advanced knowledge on the history of world war 2. From various books, documentaries and other sources of knowledge I have a thin spread knowledge of world war 2 and overall I think the results were right.
The invasion to invade Japan was risky in many ways. As stated, a million casualities to the already 400,000 American casualities was the second worst war in American deaths and that was still 400,000 at the time of the propose invasion. Some 1,400,000 American deaths at the end, if the invasion turned out as expected, could have been the result. "All is fair in love and war", as many have referenced for many years and some 120,000 immediate deaths of civilians and more later deaths from radiation or deaths from defects from radiation add to several hundred thousand Japanese deaths. The proposed plan to bomb Japan instead of invade likely had no sure civilian estimates because the technology was incredibly unknown.
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⚡🏀ʟєցi†ßɑʟʟєʀ🏀⚡ wrote:
I wasn't having a dig. Just the way I read it.Kaͣrͩaͩs wrote:
Those are the facts positive or negative,that is what they are I can't just make up facts to balance it outAll your points seem negative as if you're trying to sway the debate a bit making people believe he was wrong before the debate even begins.
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The only prior test was Whitesands, New Mexico where they tested a Uranium atomic bomb suspended on a metal tower. The test was incredibly bright and the tower was vaporized and turned the surrounding sand into glass. The power was heavily unknown and so the risk had to be taken. It was this or who knows how many American deaths, yet alone injuries. And the Japanese where fierce in prior battles and death than surrender was common. This would be ever more shown in battles on the Japanese homelands.
So the risk was taken and the plutonium bomb "Fat Man" and Uranium bomb "Little Boy" were launched on August 6th and August 9th, 1945. The bombs were kept incredibly secret and only armed before the Enola Gay was near the locations. The results were devastating as is known and soon the Japanese surrendered. I feel this was more a solution than a detriment and thus the best possibility with what was known.
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What was the bombs cause in the first place? It wasn't made to destroy land for future civilization. It was made to kill. Fined and honed in its art to leave those not instantly evaporated to slowly die. The Bomb was made to send a message: Back down or the next one's up your ass. This bomb not only hurt the present of people's lives, but it scarred their future forever. Radiation poisoning is permanent. Not denotating that bomb is like buying a guitar just to let it sit in the attic or buying a book to let it sit on the shelf. It was bound to explode one way or another. Death was unavoidable since the nuclear bomb was invented. And why not make a statement with it since we had the power to do so.
/end speech
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🔲🔴🔲True Fact🔲🔴🔲
prior to the atomic bomb, the US was planning to release a million bats (yes the one that lives in caves) plant bombs on them, and release them into the city's of Japan.
They called it: Bat Bomb -
Finlay King wrote:
Too bad all those bat bombs failed miserably and ended up blowing up a newly constructed airfield.🔲🔴🔲True Fact🔲🔴🔲
prior to the atomic bomb, the US was planning to release a million bats (yes the one that lives in caves) plant bombs on them, and release them into the city's of Japan.
They called it: Bat Bomb -
✰MAΥHΞΜ✰ wrote:
Thanks grammer nazi😒,😝.⚡🏀ʟєցi†ßɑʟʟєʀ🏀⚡ wrote:
And after out.YOU wrote:
There is supposed to be a period after areKaͣrͩaͩs wrote:
Those are the facts positive or negative,that is what they are. I can't just make up facts to balance it out.All your points seem negative as if you're trying to sway the debate a bit making people believe he was wrong before the debate even begins.
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The "All is far in love and war" wasn't the best quote now that I think about it more.
As I mean, the option seemed to be the best. It was less than a month away from six years of World War 2, America was in the war for 3 3/4 years and likely morale of soldiers and the peoples was being stressed. The invasion was 1 million causalities of Americans. The Japanese casualities, civilian or military, whether we won or not would have been also huge. It was that or the bomb as the main options. I don't know how the diplomacy situation was though. However, I felt Japan would have persisted if the diplomacy situation between them and the USA was not going very far.
Could someone link or name me to a credible source to give me an idea of the diplomatic efforts between the Japanese and USA at the time before and during the times of the bombings?
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*Facts* Japan didn't really care about us dropping the nuclear bombs, the main reason the surrendered was because the soviets had begun fighting them in the colonies and they knew they couldn't win a war against the most powerful military machine on the planet (the soviet red army) the real reason Truman decided to drop the bomb was to gain better bargaining terms when dividing up Germany and other conquered lands in Europe. The atomic bomb didn't make much of a differnce in the Japanese eyes, their city's were already being massively destroyed by constant napalm and other bombing runs day and night. Truman in my eyes was one of the worst presidents of all time mainly because he single handedly ruined relations with the Soviet Union which lead to the Cold War.
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After the nuclear bombs on Japan were detonated, guess what followed? The Cold War. Stalin realized that his mighty Red Army was useless against American nuclear weapons, and he wanted them to even the odds. One million Americans were estimated to be killed during the canceled invasion of Japan? And how many deaths were caused by those times in which the Cold War became 'hot'? Millions.
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YOU wrote:
The Japanese also had a plan to fill thousands of paper balloons with explosives, and to allow the wind to carry these balloon bombs into major cities on the West Coast.Finlay King wrote:
Too bad all those bat bombs failed miserably and ended up blowing up a newly constructed airfield.🔲🔴🔲True Fact🔲🔴🔲
prior to the atomic bomb, the US was planning to release a million bats (yes the one that lives in caves) plant bombs on them, and release them into the city's of Japan.
They called it: Bat Bomb -
Eric. wrote:
Most of this was false, the soviets wernt really afraid of the nuclear weapons. They were not intimidated by it for they were already fast on their way making their own. The truth is that Truman was afraid of the Soviet Union and saw they only as enemies. Rosevealt had good relations with the Soviet Union and Truman ruined it all. And the original estimate off American lifes thought to be lost in an invasion of Japan was much lower, lower then 100k but as the years passed Truman kept raising the estimate to 100k then 250k, 500k, 750k, then before he died he raised it to 1million.✂ American nuclear weapons, and he wanted them to even the odds. One million Americans were estimated to be killed during the canceled invasion of Japan? And how many deaths were caused by those times in which the Cold War became 'hot'? Millions.
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⚡🏀ʟєցi†ßɑʟʟєʀ🏀⚡ wrote:
It was 50mph, sporty.killing us all (yes it is true, scientists also thought humans would explode if they went more than 20 mph in a car 😂)
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UnknownAssassin wrote:
Little Boy was dropped from the Enola Gay, Fat Man was dropped from Bockscar.✂It was this or who knows how many American deaths, yet alone injuries. And the Japanese where fierce in prior battles and death than surrender was common. This would be ever more shown in battles on the Japanese homelands.
So the risk was taken and the plutonium bomb "Fat Man" and Uranium bomb "Little Boy" were launched on August 6th and August 9th, 1945. The bombs were kept incredibly secret and only armed before the Enola Gay was near the locations. The results were devastating as is known and soon the Japanese surrendered. I feel this was more a solution than a detriment and thus the best possibility with what was known.
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Benny DaBOSS🔫💀🌄 wrote:
Even if the Soviets weren't scared of the A-bombs that the U.S. had used, it isn't false when I say that the Red Army would be proven useless against such a weapon. As for the United States' good relations with the Soviets, well....If your nation is at war with one of the strongest countries in Europe, whose leader declares that every other culture besides his is inferior, and if the Americans tell you that they're going to open up a second front in Europe, but it takes them three years to actually do the thing and they're just telling you that for three whole years then....yeah...Eric. wrote:
✂.✂ American nuclear weapons, and he wanted them to even the odds. One million Americans were estimated to be killed during the canceled invasion of Japan? And how many deaths were caused by those times in which the Cold War became 'hot'? Millions.
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Benny DaBOSS🔫💀🌄 wrote:
I think Stalin played a role in the events that led to the Cold War. Did Truman perform perfectly? No. Did Stalin offer anything the other allies would consider? No. Plenty of blame to pass around.✂ the real reason Truman decided to drop the bomb was to gain better bargaining terms when dividing up Germany and other conquered lands in Europe. The atomic bomb didn't make much of a differnce in the Japanese eyes, their city's were already being massively destroyed by constant napalm and other bombing runs day and night. Truman in my eyes was one of the worst presidents of all time mainly because he single handedly ruined relations with the Soviet Union which lead to the Cold War.
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Eric. wrote:
Idk if you're trying to argue are agree with me, either way the soviets could have kicked our ass either way. The truth is we were the bad guys in this or Truman's edministration was. Rosevealt had promised the Soviet Union the bulk of an aide program to restore their broken country but Truman gave them close to none.Benny DaBOSS🔫💀🌄 wrote:
✂ As for the United States' good relations with the Soviets, well....If your nation is at war with one of the strongest countries in Europe, whose leader declares that every other culture besides his is inferior, and if the Americans tell you that they're going to open up a second front in Europe, but it takes them three years to actually do the thing and they're just telling you that for three whole years then....yeah...Eric. wrote:
✂.✂
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Benny DaBOSS🔫💀🌄 wrote:
It is easy to have "good relations" with someone when you share a common enemy, less so when the threat is removed.Eric. wrote:
Most of this was false, the soviets wernt really afraid of the nuclear weapons. They were not intimidated by it for they were already fast on their way making their own. The truth is that Truman was afraid of the Soviet Union and saw they only as enemies. Rosevealt had good relations with the Soviet Union and Truman ruined it all. And the original estimate off American lifes thought to be lost in an invasion of Japan was much lower, lower then 100k but as the years passed Truman kept raising the estimate to 100k then 250k, 500k, 750k, then before he died he raised it to 1million.✂
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My opinion is who am I to question what Truman did by dropping those bombs? I'm sure he did at the time think it was best for his country and his people. I don't think he took that decision lightly and I'm glad I'd never have to make a decision like that.
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ℜagɳar Loðbrók wrote:
It easier to give things you promise to people who are very powerful that you can easily work with in the future, The Soviet Union joined the war against Japan which wasn't the war just to help us. Truman responded by trying to be a big man at the table when he was just a little boy.Benny DaBOSS🔫💀🌄 wrote:
It is easy to have "good relations" with someone when you share a common enemy, less so when the threat is removed.Eric. wrote:
✂✂Rosevealt had good relations with the Soviet Union and Truman ruined it all. And the original estimate off American lifes thought to be lost in an invasion of Japan was much lower, lower then 100k but as the years passed Truman kept raising the estimate to 100k then 250k, 500k, 750k, then before he died he raised it to 1million.✂
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Add: OLSEN wrote:
He did it to try and scare the soviets into a better agreement over Europe which didn't work.My opinion is who am I to question what Truman did by dropping those bombs? I'm sure he did at the time think it was best for his country and his people. I don't think he took that decision lightly and I'm glad I'd never have to make a decision like that.
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Fuckayoo dolphin and a fuckayooo whale!!!!!
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Benny DaBOSS🔫💀🌄 wrote:
It takes two to tango. Stalin had plenty of reason to enter the war against Japan other than simply to aid the U.S. He sought to expand Soviet holdings in the East and exert greater influence in post war China. Stalin's actions in the East were far from simply altruistic assistance to an ally.ℜagɳar Loðbrók wrote:
It easier to give things you promise to people who are very powerful that you can easily work with in the future, The Soviet Union joined the war against Japan which wasn't the war just to help us. Truman responded by trying to be a big man at the table when he was just a little boy.Benny DaBOSS🔫💀🌄 wrote:
It is easy to have "good relations" with someone when you share a common enemy, less so when the threat is removed.Eric. wrote:
✂✂✂✂
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If we invaded japan it would have been more money and lives. I believe more Japanese civilians would have been killed in the constant bombings and raids from the ground. The bombs were the best way because less american lives would have been lost. The Japanese would have not surrendered on their homeland at all. They learned that they must kill as much Americans as possible. This invasion would have been horrific for both sides.
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