Government Shutdown.
Forums › General Discussion › Government Shutdown.-
!ZAZ wrote:
Yes, yes, and yes.So what am I, a citizen, going to have to do? Renew my passport, lose my social security? Are my liscences void?
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I agree with Brown, Big Rob, and OTB. If the government shutdown occurs it will be disasterous for the GOP. Let's face it. Politically the GOP is in a rough spot. The tea party has divided the GOP and if things continue to degrade 2012 is going to be a rough year. If the shutdown occurs it will be like the '90's when Clinton won reelection.
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The democrats put a 'reasonable' counteroffer for cuts on the table that meets the cuts the GOP initially demanded. Tea Party members, such as Bachman, want more cuts. This, demand will not be met even within the GOP. If shutdown occurs the GOP will be seen as damaged and vulnerable. The GOP has accomplished little even though it has spent a great deal the entire duration of the current presidential administration. This already degrades traction for them. Furthermore, the fact that Democrats have done very little promotion also reflects poorly on GOP efforts considering major advocacy spending of the GOP. Bottom line is that during the Obama administration Democratic dreams came true and the GOP were out of touch with the people. Government shutdown would indicate utter impotence of GOP efforts as they are not using smart politics here. The GOP really has no major candidates for the presidency. That is a problem.
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A shut down (of nonessentials) is probably what our govt needs right now. Think of it this way they are extremely fat and need to lose a few pounds. Take some fat and carbs out of their diet and add some protein. It will hurt in the beginning but after awhile it will be healthier, faster, more efficient and overall better.
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Communism failed because of no incentive because of "standardized pay" for positions (Soviet Union proved that). Capitalism will fail because the gap between wealth and poverty has grown tremendously. Let alone the percentage of the wealthy has decreased while the percentage of their wealth in the economy has increased. Government can try and interfere by creating stimulus' but in the long run when taxes don't get raised, rather they get cut or stay the same, benefits continue (and eventually will be cut), when we go to war and don't leave, we continue to spend money we don't make and continue to go into debt while the wealthy continue to exploit the economy (oil industry) and the middle class, us, our children, and their children will have to pay the price. In a matter of only a few years we will see this paradigm shift. Capitalism doesn't work anymore! Or at least not the way it has been heading.
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And what's nonessential? The "War on Terror" is one. The Medicare spending increase Bush put into play for seniors when they are staying alive longer then when they set the senior age limit. And we made tax cuts and spent nearly a billion dollars a day on wars for how many years? that is nonessential. We spend money on having our military protecting poppy fields for a country where 90% of the worlds' heroin comes from in the middle east. Then we go and spend probably billions of dollars on outlawing heroin in the United States. And what I mean by outlawing includes political salaries, law enforcement salaries, and all the "necessary" spending to enforce these laws. We have wars to make rich people richer while killing an hurting maby people on their homeland. But heaven forbid somebody brings it to our soil.
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This whole bullshit country is run poorly. And unfortunately there are too many stupid or, to be PC, uneducated people in this country that listen to speeches that really mean nothing and they sit and prey and feel part of group/family/gang/cause when they're being patriotic. F@&$ yeah we're the best and strongest! Land of free and stupid.
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Good Nite 415 wrote:
You want to give it a try.This whole bullshit country is run poorly. And unfortunately there are too many stupid or, to be PC, uneducated people in this country that listen to speeches that really mean nothing and they sit and prey and feel part of group/family/gang/cause when they're being patriotic. F@&$ yeah we're the best and strongest! Land of free and stupid.
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I don't know if I am qualified. But I sure can see many problems and would be able to educate myself on what people to choose to fix this way of life regardless if it means changing our government and everything it stands for. Start from scratch and have a decent budget to choose these right people to figure out what would be the best system for the moment and build on it. Rathther than allowing this dual party government to sit and trivially argue semantics on how to fix the economy. It just isn't working. But people have so much faith in our system. And you know what faith does.
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Jim Dirt, my brain is telling me that those who want the government to shutdown, reflect on Somalia. The government shutdown there. Non essential, yes let's close down the national parks, libraries, road repair, etc because they are not essential. Let's drag our knuckles on the ground and piss away any advantage we have as a society to save a few dollars in taxes per person. With my money saved from taxes I will purchase a militia membership/benefits card.
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@ good nite I agree that Bush tax cuts are causing issues as the wealthy are clearly benefitting and trickle down economics is failure. 👎
However, I think that honest hardworking people who are trying to do well for their constituents exist. There is reason for optimism.
The view on the poppy fields is interesting and has been documented.
www.nytimes.com/2010/03/21/world/asia/21marja.html
It is a political move to gain trust of the people in those countries. I certainly don't think it is a permanent solution. This was our situation a few years ago:
www.nytimes.com/2009/04/29/world/asia/29afghan.html
I agree war is expensive; however, here we are in a war.
It is easy to talk of 'the masses'. Realize you are one of us. This country is not bs. I have travelled the world. I've seen some places. You know another place you would rather be? Diving into research into any of your topics in real papers and reputable sources will show how dynamic these issues are. This is not simple Simon stuff here.
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You guys want all national parks and monuments to close? That's what happens, they just try to hurt us so we will pay more taxes
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understand that it's complicated. More complicated than the few examples I've given that pales to the hundreds that could be listed. In this society where nonessential spending is in education is why we have too many uneducated people who listen to other uneducated people who have money (mostly politicians or entertainers) speek about issues that they have no knowledge on or are blantantly deceiving people about situations at hand (i.e. global warming, war on terror, the economy is fine, etc). And unfortunately in a society where a huge percentage of the population is uneducated on anything in life they will listen to these powerful people and if they at all like the person (maybe because they are christian, good looking, republican/democrat) or if, in their limited knowledge, they can reason what they hear then they're sold and vote for stupid ideas or promises.
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This system of government a nd economy does not work. Another place who's government and economy is doing better is China. I'm not saying I want to live their, but their government maintained communism while changing the economic system to a free market and they're thriving. Now I'm not saying that communism or socialism is the solution I'm saying that this ain't workin' and we need outside the box kind of change. Politicians/government officials should feel the suffering they cause when they make huge F ups. Bush and his cohorts should be jailed or pay for what they've done. Just like referees should be penalized for making really bad calls that can drastically affect the outcome of a game. But they don't! Therefore this system allows them to line their pockets and their friends pockets by exploiting us without taking any personal or financial responsibility. .
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Again these are few examples/situations that I'm listing to shed light on how this system DOES NOT WORK. We need dramatic change. Not just stimulus and paying out to the people who F 'd up more money to allow them to continue F 'ing us over. I don't want to pay for Bush's F ups! I don't want my children or their children to have to pay either! Why should we? It's not right or fair! What did I do wrong? What did the uneducated people do wrong when they're fed BS yet they were never taught how to think. That's why there needs to be a paradigm shift.
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Good Nite 415 wrote:
Another place who's government and economy is doing better is China. I'm not saying I want to live their, but their government maintained communism while changing the economic system to a free market and they're thriving...
Bush and his cohorts should be jailed or pay for what they've done.
Have you been to China? My wife has. My good friend spent the last two years there. If this is what you call 'thriving' then you are welcome to it. Also, the war and politics there are every bit as nasty. Worse in my opinion. Also, you would not be able to talk so freely there. Check out what happened to China's recent Nobel prize winner.
Also, though I disagree with almost everything the Bush administration did, clearly his father was better, I do think he represented his constituents. He represented oil and big business. He even attempted an education program. The problem was the lack of funding.
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Education spending in New York is $14,119 per student. Utah is $5,257. Arizona (my sad and deeply conservative state) is $6,281. Average is 8k per student a state. Many challenges exist: inequality, diversity, multi-lingual populations, politics, over population of retiries, poor teacher pay, despair of arts, testing, loopholes, evaluations, fair assessments, pay disparity, sexual abuse, violence, on and on.
I encourage individuals to take action. Pick an issue you care about and work each week to improve things. Constantly research it. change happens one day at a time. If it were easy everyone would do it.
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Nixon was just given a museum exhibit documenting his scandals. He is the only US president to resign due to impeachment. Ford pardoned him as a political move. It is discussed in a book called '31 Day's.' Might be an interesting read.
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I didn't say that China was a great place to live or the rights they have are better but their economy is thriving. If capitalism is so much better then how come they're buying a our bonds and we most likely can't pay it back unless me, my children, their children, and their childrens' children will end up paying our debt off in sky high taxes. I don't want that. That's wrong! That's why I say a serious change in the system needs to happen.
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A change does need to happen, not fairly compensating federal workers is not the way to do it. I make a decent living, I also took a wage cut when I accepted this job. For the most part federal workers, especially the skilled ones, make less than their private sector counterparts. As slow as a lot of govt processes are now what happens when all the truly skilled federal workers leave for the private sector?
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Good Nite 415 wrote:
You say our economy is good? I live in China, and my rule is, I would rather have less money than to have my house crashing down on me or being robbed and killed the next night.I didn't say that China was a great place to live or the rights they have are better but their economy is thriving. If capitalism is so much better then how come they're buying a our bonds and we most likely can't pay it back unless me, my children, their children, and their childrens' children will end up paying our debt off in sky high taxes. I don't want that. That's wrong! That's why I say a serious change in the system needs to happen.
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This thread lost me at "ballywhoo"......................
(hint: I'm hinting at what Democrats do to Republicans and vice versa)
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Good Nite 415 wrote:
They buy our bonds because we are a good investment. We will pay it back. They know that. Apparently, you don't know that though.I didn't say that China was a great place to live or the rights they have are better but their economy is thriving. If capitalism is so much better then how come they're buying a our bonds and we most likely can't pay it back unless me, my children, their children, and their childrens' children will end up paying our debt off in sky high taxes. I don't want that. That's wrong! That's why I say a serious change in the system needs to happen.
You definitely should figure out how the economy works before you start talking about it. Don't invest in stocks pal. You will get hosed. The US is a secure investment. Believe that.
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"The Man" wrote:
My brother is serving our country. He is planning on going into the private sector. He will make three times or more what he currently makes. He will be working at the same base, in the same place, with nicer accommodations.A change does need to happen, not fairly compensating federal workers is not the way to do it. I make a decent living, I also took a wage cut when I accepted this job. For the most part federal workers, especially the skilled ones, make less than their private sector counterparts. As slow as a lot of govt processes are now what happens when all the truly skilled federal workers leave for the private sector?
Thank you for serving our country. 👍👏👏👏👏🇺🇸
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Well after all of this it isn't shutting down.
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