🔥Mouse with 2 moms debate.🔥
Forums › General Discussion › 🔥Mouse with 2 moms debate.🔥-
I read that some scientist have been able to let 2 female mice have children together and are hoping that this will help same sex couples. What do you think about this? Is it good to manipulate our gene pool? Is it good to mess with natural selection? Would the positive consequences outweigh the negative ones?
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Please, no gay bashing. If you hate gays, keep it to yourself. Nobody cares.
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We've always manipulated gene pools. Bred strongest or colours etc even in flowers and animals. So why not.
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The ethical implications are the same as for any in vitro reproduction. The sex of the parents is immaterial.
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For the most part, this is used to overcome infertility issues, not to improve the gene pool. It could be argued that this hurts the gene pool because the offspring are more likely to be infertile as well.
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In another sense, all of human civilization is one huge attempt to mess with natural selection. Vaccinations, eyeglasses, heated shelters all allow "weaker" people to survive. It is arguable that this attempt to escape from natural selection is what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom and makes us human.
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Thumbs Riley wrote:
Good point.In another sense, all of human civilization is one huge attempt to mess with natural selection. Vaccinations, eyeglasses, heated shelters all allow "weaker" people to survive. It is arguable that this attempt to escape from natural selection is what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom and makes us human.
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certusd wrote:
"We've always done it, so why not?" Great argument. Likewise, we've always fought wars with each other, so why not keep doing it forever?We've always manipulated gene pools. Bred strongest or colours etc even in flowers and animals. So why not.
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★Λubergine★ wrote:
The irony of this aub is that natural selection overturns same sex concepts. It is totally against evolution so how is trying to supress evolution in some way improving evolution according to cert's comment?certusd wrote:
"We've always done it, so why not?" Great argument. Likewise, we've always fought wars with each other, so why not keep doing it forever?We've always manipulated gene pools. Bred strongest or colours etc even in flowers and animals. So why not.
Aub good point buddy
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☣ 🎸ӈɪƖƖßıƖƖγ🎸☣ wrote:
Well it isnt a good point. BecUse its a fallacy of division. In one case we are improving our biology the other is supressing its nature.Thumbs Riley wrote:
Good point.In another sense, all of human civilization is one huge attempt to mess with natural selection. Vaccinations, eyeglasses, heated shelters all allow "weaker" people to survive. It is arguable that this attempt to escape from natural selection is what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom and makes us human.
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₳ʉ₲ʉṣϮḭ₦ê (₳ⓑ€) wrote:
See, this is why we haven't ever cloned a human. Not because we can't, but because people get into rediculous biological and philosophical arguments about what is right, and why should we do it. But, in the words of Cave Johnson, "Science isn't about why, it's about WHY NOT?"☣ 🎸ӈɪƖƖßıƖƖγ🎸☣ wrote:
Well it isnt a good point. BecUse its a fallacy of division. In one case we are improving our biology the other is supressing its nature.Thumbs Riley wrote:
Good point.In another sense, all of human civilization is one huge attempt to mess with natural selection. Vaccinations, eyeglasses, heated shelters all allow "weaker" people to survive. It is arguable that this attempt to escape from natural selection is what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom and makes us human.
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Shoot. Realized I made that quote into a question, and misspelled "ridiculous". Thanks, autocorrect!
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Right or wrong, I do think this is a waste of scientific resources. They should be doing other things like curing diseases. That is more important than making same sex couples have children IMO. There are plenty of orphans out there that deserve homes that could be adopted.
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Do we really need to find more ways to reproduce? We need to find ways to control our population, not help boost it.
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I thought this was made to first help infertile people, but if a same sex couple wants to biologically have a kid then I say go for it. I don't see why not
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₳ʉ₲ʉṣϮḭ₦ê (₳ⓑ€) wrote:
*facepalm*☣ 🎸ӈɪƖƖßıƖƖγ🎸☣ wrote:
Well it isnt a good point. BecUse its a fallacy of division. In one case we are improving our biology the other is supressing its nature.Thumbs Riley wrote:
Good point.In another sense, all of human civilization is one huge attempt to mess with natural selection. Vaccinations, eyeglasses, heated shelters all allow "weaker" people to survive. It is arguable that this attempt to escape from natural selection is what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom and makes us human.
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Thumbs Riley wrote:
We're not just moving away from natural selection, but kind of defeating it. Glasses, vaccines, etc are humanity's way to help those who had inferior genes. This is another scientific step in overcoming biological problems.In another sense, all of human civilization is one huge attempt to mess with natural selection. Vaccinations, eyeglasses, heated shelters all allow "weaker" people to survive. It is arguable that this attempt to escape from natural selection is what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom and makes us human.
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We evolved a brain. Everything we do with that brain in my opinion is "natural". This is a very complicated subject and I would recommend studying the subject before having an opinion.
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Charles Darwin theory is still a theory because humans are not animal. What im saying is these experiments happen to a mice. And doesnt apply to human at all.
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Humans are animals in every physical sense. We share 99% of our genes with mice (as well as most other mammals). It's the metaphysics that get tricky.
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☣ 🎸ӈɪƖƖßıƖƖγ🎸☣ wrote:
I agree that this is the strongest argument against it, and I say this as the father of two in vitro girls. Was it right for me to spend all those thousands of dollars just to pass on my genes? I still don't know.Right or wrong, I do think this is a waste of scientific resources. They should be doing other things like curing diseases. That is more important than making same sex couples have children IMO. There are plenty of orphans out there that deserve homes that could be adopted.
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Am i the only one who thought of the movie " Children of Men" after reading this story? or "Splice"? or "Species"? or Spiderman? or "Blade Runner"? or "Jurassic Park", or blah blah?
messing with genetics didnt always go so good for those guys... just saying.
also stop eating GMO foods.
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oh and are we just discussing same sex pregnancies, or Genetic Modification, gene manipulation, in general?
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I will say that the desire to have ones own biological children can be incredibly strong. (Evolutionarily speaking, this makes perfect sense, even if it doesn't make economic or sociological sense.) And there is something truly amazing about seeing aspects of yourself in your children.
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༄☣βŁιnd☠Łιmιτ☣༄ wrote:
Palm, meet face.Charles Darwin theory is still a theory because humans are not animal. What im saying is these experiments happen to a mice. And doesnt apply to human at all.
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My girls are bright, creative, caring individuals who have the potential to make enormous contributions to their community. I can't regret bringing them into the world even if it might have been "better" to adopt.
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GreenPhoeni/x/ wrote: ✂✂✂
I really don't get what people have against GMO crops. Yes, Monsanto is a bunch of heartless fucking pricks, but without GMO crops, a lot of foods we have today would be extinct, or simply inedible. Part of the reason the Banana is going extinct is because Eco-fags throw a hissy-fit every time someone suggests a genetic solution to a genetic problem. If we went without GMO, our crop yields simply wouldn't be enough. And the guvnamint isn't putting any mind-control hormones in your food, either.also stop eating GMO foods.
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🔰Superyan🔰 wrote:
*yawn*₳ʉ₲ʉṣϮḭ₦ê (₳ⓑ€) wrote:
*facepalm*☣ 🎸ӈɪƖƖßıƖƖγ🎸☣ wrote:
Well it isnt a good point. BecUse its a fallacy of division. In one case we are improving our biology the other is supressing its nature.Thumbs Riley wrote:
Good point.In another sense, all of human civilization is one huge attempt to mess with natural selection. Vaccinations, eyeglasses, heated shelters all allow "weaker" people to survive. It is arguable that this attempt to escape from natural selection is what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom and makes us human.
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ϻ͞ċȵя͟ɗƖҽ wrote:
The movies Green cited might give you a clue - anti-GMO people are just looking at the worst-case scenarios, which are pretty scary. That's the nature of worst-case scenarios. Personally, I'm with you. Humans have been genetically modifying their food for thousands of years. They've just been doing it through selective breeding. However, that takes so much longer that it doesn't seem scary, since the changes happen over generations.GreenPhoeni/x/ wrote: ✂✂✂
I really don't get what people have against GMO crops.✂✂✂also stop eating GMO foods.
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I think we should stick to what nature says to do. MARRY THE OPPOSITE SEX. Don't mess around with people's genes
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sebastian5367 wrote:
I'm just going to be blunt here.I think we should stick to what nature says to do. MARRY THE OPPOSITE SEX. Don't mess around with people's genes
Fucking ignorance like this is pathetic. We are the most evolved & smartest species. We as a race (a whole HUMAN race) should not simply stick to nature. We have opened the doors to advanced scienctific discoveries and you're choosing to not explore new discoveries?!? Fucking waste of our free will. This may prove to be beneficial to same sex couples, possibly worldwide. If we only stick to our genes without improvements, there'd be minimal treatment for disease, no glasses, disaster for humanity.
Same sex couples do not hurt you or your freedom, so it is bullshit that you'd justify suppressing their free will. Goddamn shameful of you.
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